Orbis Enters the Ring
The much-awaited Orbis Ring Flash adapter is finally coming off the production lines. Enlight Photo has moved from a teaser site to the Full Monty, with lots more details and pix.Orbis is the first (non-DIY) competitor to the Ray Flash, and lowers the entry cost for a commercial ring flash adapter.
Highlights:
• Introductory Price: $169 US (with $16.99 shipping to US - for other areas see site)
• One size fits most all shoe-mount flashes -- except the big-headed Vivitar 285, apparently.
• Requires off-camera sync of some kind (can use off-camera TTL cord)
• Larger lighting surface area than Ray Flash - (should be softer light, will test soon)
• First units ship in December, in three weeks
More details, FAQ, pix, etc., at Orbis website.
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Posted at 2:21 AM.
49 Comments:
Thats good news! Hope it will be available in Poland as well :)
I like this as a contender to the Ray Ringflash and I am sure it will be welcomed at the lower price but a few things concern me...
Maybe the Ray flash was designed only for the 580EX II and SB 800 because other flashes don't put out enough power to be very effective in this type of setup ... and the Ray Ringflash will attach to your attached flash, making it easier to handhold both units in a more stable manner... I can just imagine trying to hold onto this plastic unit, with a flash sticking out of it and having a off camera cord getting in the way OR having the IR trigger system MISS FIRE while outside due to funky line of sight.
Also, they state "later" a on camera attachment will be released...so like what, another $100 to throw at it for the kit? Even if it all comes at a cheaper price, I see it as a shortcut to the Ray Ringflash design...but best to have choices for all budgets.
Finally one that I might consider buying. Can't wait for Dave to test drive it cause I'm doubting that some of the pics on the Orbis website were taken with it. I think they used a regular ringflash on some of the pics. I hope I'm wrong. What do you guys think??? Thanks for reading
NOTE TO EVERYONE WHO HAS TRIED TO POST COMMENTS ABOUT THE "CHEAPER" VERSION OF THE RAY FLASH:
FWIW, this is a counterfeit of the Ray Flash design. They basically stole the design, altering only the flash mount. The main body of the ring flash is a detail-for-detail rip off. It is cheaper because they did not have to do the expensive design and testing.
I do not feel comfortable having this site serve as a springboard for companies who engage in that kind of behavior, so I have chosen not to moderate into publication those comments which talk about and point to knockoff products.
My thinking is that if we reward the unscrupulous companies that bypass the R&D process merely to rip off someone else's design, we contribute to the decreasing viability of making cool new products in the first place.
Thanks for understanding.
-DH
Excellent news. It looks like a great product and brings prices down towards a sensible level :-)
Any idea how the flash attaches?
So I'm holding my camera. I put this ring flash around the lens. The flash attaches to the ring flash but not to the hot shoe. What supports the flash?
still seems like alot of $ at 169.
bl
You might change your comment on the "cheaper" ray flash. When I first read it I thought you were calling the Orbis a counterfeit Ray Flash.
David, re: the "cheaper" version of Rayflash. It's inevitable in these hard economic times that people are going to look for a "bargain".
However, apart from the immorality of supporting intellectual theft, there are other reasons for not buying from this maker:
1) Buying these replicas means you are supporting a system which abuses human rights.
2) Workers in the sweatshops where they are made have no health and safety protection; regularly work for 14-16 hrs per day; are often children.
3) The quality of the goods is not checked with any rigour.
4) Should your goods not arrive the buyer has none of the normal safeguards associated with buying online.
So unlike Bob Dylan we should think twice because it's not alright.
Cheers
Pat
charging $300 for a ray flash is robbery, the alien bees ring flash is $100 more and yes its heavier, but puts out 300ws. if they sold that cheap piece of plastic Ray flash for $50-$100 dollar you wouldn't need the Orbis. If you pay for your equipment out of your own pocket then having a cheaper solution out there is good for me. (Speaking for the little people)
I disagree with David. It's a ringflash..not some ultra-complicated scientific breakthrough. Most products on the market use prior research and designs to build new versions and create competition. How many Chinese knockoffs of pre-existing "expensive" technology are there...the ebay flash and shutter remotes are a good examples. Personally, I think a lot of the "special" photo equipment like this is WAY over-priced...like Gary Fong's tupperware attachment (and yes, I have them and the knockoffs as well..both work just as well). $50 for a $1 piece of injected mold plastic? I have tons of fad photo items...most are way over priced for the quality and functionality. Most can be made DIY.
My only concern with the Orbis is the way the flash attaches...hanging from the bottom to me seems..well..clumsy and potentially dangerous. And at $170..still over priced since it doesn't include ANY kind of electronics.
Under FAQ's, there's a question/answer specifically about how many stops of light this eats up. And by answer, I mean they would make great politicians. They do not answer in the least, they just say it's "enough" because you do ring flash stuff at close range. Thanks. What, with all that precise technical info, how can I not trust them? Sign me up! FWIW, the Ray Flash eats up a little bit more than the 1 stop I read about.
David--If taking someone's design and making it with your own materials is not OK, then you may need to rethink all of those DIY posts. The only difference is one is for sale. Both may diminish sales of the original design. Seems a bit like a double standard to me.
-Mike
Looks pretty cool, but I wonder how much flash power will be diffused... Given that we're just working with a shoe mount flash... I just noticed that all of the gallery photos were studio shots. If you could use this outdoors as well I'm in though!
I looked into the gallery and the baby closeup (the 6th) shows that the catch light is a "bitten bagle". Is there any *portable* ringflash---be it rayflash or this or any other similar design on ebay etc---that gives a truly circular catch light? Or is photoshoping required for all portable designs? Thanks!
David,
It would be interesting to see how this ring flash plays into your on axis fill light posts. I'm know I would be interested to see the effects of on axis standard flash fill vs on axis ring flash fill.
Thanks
The lack of a fitting kit is a deal-killer for me.
Having a reasonably convenient means of attaching the ring adapter to my lens is an absolute must for most applications.
Looks pretty cheap. As for stealing the idea. I think they didn't steal that many ideas. The orbis version looks pretty bad.
It seems to have a diffuser over the top of the disk to lower the output of light to compensate for the lack of light getting to the bottom of the disc.
While the ray flash attempts to get more light to the bottom for even lighting, and use all the power of the speedlight.
The orbis wastes the output of the flash.
Ray Flash = better than DIY
Orbis = the same as DIY (or worse)
Wow.
Several sniping, anonymous comments coming in. If you are gonna be a hater, at least sign your name.
Anonymous sniping looks weenie-ish and just cheapens the whole discussion. Please note the TOS, above.
Thx,
DH
David,
Long time reader, first time commenter.
You wrote:
FWIW, this is a counterfeit of the Ray Flash design. They basically stole the design, altering only the flash mount. The main body of the ring flash is a detail-for-detail rip off. It is cheaper because they did not have to do the expensive design and testing.
I do not feel comfortable having this site serve as a springboard for companies who engage in that kind of behavior, so I have chosen not to moderate into publication those comments which talk about and point to knockoff products.
My thinking is that if we reward the unscrupulous companies that bypass the R&D process merely to rip off someone else's design, we contribute to the decreasing viability of making cool new products in the first place.
I like the Ray Flash, have talked to Eric Sowder at ExpoImaging, the US distributor, about the products pros and cons, its development, and its seemingly high cost. I still think it is expensive. It was inevitable that someone was going to make a similar product for less.
Your site gets a ton of traffic daily and in essence is giving Orbis a ton of free publicity. More than they could have got on their own. If you feel this product is totally ripping the Ray Flash off, why did you even post its release and availability?
Personally I'm very excited about this and can't wait to get mine. If I didn't know about this product, I would have already purchased the Ray Flash. I think it will be a nice addition to the arsenal, especially when I'm trying to travel light. I think there is definitely a space for something like this (and the Ray Flash for that matter). It's not going to be a replacement for a real, powerful, ringflash, but I can definitely see many uses for it in my style of shooting.
If Orbis really did rip off the Ray flash, then there would be a patent infringement lawsuit already filed. C'mon people. As someone else already said, this kind of technology has been around a long time. The Ray flash doesn't get a monopoly on the technology!
And as for concerns about holding the Orbis, put it on a lightstand and use a transmitter.
I love the price -- the Ray flash seems way overpriced to me -- but I will probably wait until Strobist and others publish reviews.
In the end this device might not end up being as inexpensive as what we might think. Right now you have to hand hold it, which you could do with the Ray Flash to get it off camera. If you want to get the Orbis on camera, you have to wait until 2009 and buy some extra parts to get it on camera. More parts means more money shipping as well. In the end it will still be over $200 for that same thing as the Ray Flash.
I have purchased the Gary Fong Lightsphere and feel that it is overpriced. I will not fall into a "trendy new camera toy" trap again unless someone can really show me that the Ray Flash or Orbis is really that great.
I Do not think this product is a ripoff of the Rayflash. I think it is an improvement in all areas where the Rayflash went wrong. Blocking the AF assist makes the product completely useless to me. Also having that kind of weight supported only by a hot shoe mount that is made to break off can really spoil an event when your mount breaks. I actually spent the time to come up with some examples to redesign the Rayflash and sent it to the company a while back, but they didn't give a S#!T. Orbis FTW! :)
sweet!
I Do not think this product is a ripoff of the Rayflash. I think it is an improvement in all areas where the Rayflash went wrong. Blocking the AF assist makes the product completely useless to me. Also having that kind of weight supported only by a hot shoe mount that is made to break off can really spoil an event when your mount breaks. I actually spent the time to come up with some examples to redesign the Rayflash and sent it to the company a while back, but they didn't give a S#!T. Orbis FTW! :)
Um, some of you have gotten the wrong idea from my previous comment. I do not think the Orbis is a rip-off of the Ray Flash.
Orbis is both substantially different than the Ray Flash and was in development long before the current iteration of the Ray Flash came out.
I was speaking of the Asian knockoff Ray Flash copies, links to which have been submitted to the comments but have not been published.
The knock-offs appear to actually have been diect copies of the light tunneling mechanisms of the Ray Flash.
I think the Orbis and the Ray Flash are substantially different, were both designed independently, will give photographers a clear choice between two designs and will serve to keep pricing in check.
That's a good thing. Selling the fake "Goochy" purse version of the Ray Flash on Korean eBay is not a good thing. (There is actually a store on B-Way in NYC with big signs out for "Prato" designer clothing. Sheesh.
Just to make myself a little clearer, hopefully.
-DH
Both are so over priced it's unbelievable - any 2nd year industrial design student with a knowledge of AutoCad could knock up this design in an hour - injection moulding is not rocket science - open a China Trade directory and see what's available - still if Profoto made it it would be $1300
Thanks for clearing that up David. I think there was some confusion -- and assumptions that Orbis was the culprit -- stemming from your initial post because you didn't name names. Now that Orbis is back in our good graces, I look forward to trying it or waiting for you to give it a go!
For those having issues with usage of the Orbis, the first setup that springs to mind is...
- Flash on monopod*, oriented vertically, with suitable cable/trigger mechanism.
- Orbis on the flash.
- Hold monopod in left hand
- Hold camera in right hand
- Aim through the hole
- Push button ;)
* or tripod, lightstand, any other support of your choosing
I can't believe they're releasing this now! damn the uk pound for being so low at the moment!!
I got a little concerned after David's "Cheaper Rayflash" comment. Like many I thought he was referring to Orbis and that really got me worried as I have placed my pre-order before I saw that comment. I was seriously considering withdrawing my order.. Such is the faith we entrust on this website :) Would be good for David to be more clear cut in the future.
This looks like a great product. If I had the $ right now, I'd be very interested! But Christmas is coming, and I have kids, so no photo-yummies for me.
I'd be interested to see some more "telling" shots of it in action, perhaps in less-controlled environments, and even used as the sole light source. Also higher image quality would be nice (rather than the tiny files embedded in the presentation).
In any case, I'm glad this product is out there. Fair competition is a Good Thing for all involved, especially us.
Guy, guys guys.. I'm here in Auckland New Zealand where James is based and I have met him and played with the pre-production model of the Orbis and can tell you it's very well built and an awful lot of trial, error and thought has gone into the design of this thing.
A couple of you expressed concerns with the way the flash is supported, don't worry you don't need three hands to operate it.. the flash clips into the base neatly and you hold the whole thing in one hand.. no problems.
Regarding light distribution, let me tell you (as a lighting engineer) that the system James uses is very clever and from my experience produces a very even distribution of light around the ring BTW the diffused part is at the base, not the top, since that's where the strobe is DUH!!
For me it's a great solution compared to the Rayflash since the Rayflash does not come in a configuration to suit Sony/Minolta gear. Who cares if I have to hand hold it??
I wish James all the best with the project, it's been a long road to this point.
Hmmm....possible mods to make this fit the 285HV?
Will wait and see, seems inevitable.
Soooooo if it doesn't jive with a Vivitar 285, does it work with the Nikon SB-900? That head is of similar girth (i.e. LARGE). Seems odd they wouldn't design to accommodate larger heads given their relatively common use.
Certainly a better price point than the Ray Flash, but not a great answer for $$$ me thinks.
As james said I cannot see myself holding this either. I think I am going to save my money and get the Alien Bee's Ring flash and power pack instead. It will take longer but I have enough of these 15 minutes of fame photo gear only to be disappointed and a waste of money,time and ends up just sitting there collecting dust. In reality not much more considering what you get. My other issue is impact resistance not very high with ABS plastic unless they increased the proportions of polybutadiene but then wjen you do this to ABS it will imact other areas of the plastic itself not to mention the cost.
David - your last comment has cleared up (for me at least) what your original comment's confusion...
my 2 cents on it is just the way that pattens work; having some background: (short form) there are some that are for north America and some that are worldwide. It's much more economical to get the US patten and have it produced in Asia is usually the route taken, however that then opens up the people manufacturing it to know all the secrets and then make their own and sell it for less (like you said, no research/development, etc) When there wasn't such a global economy like there is today, it wasn't as much of an issue...
However it's nice to hear of integrity on the internet and I look forward to seeing your take on the Orbis
For what its worth. the proof of the pudding is in the baking...
All Design is adaptation... Period.
If the $ price gets me the shots / then hey. I'm there.
A wedding for $2500 seems a bit much eh..
Re: the earlier comment about some of the demo photos on the Orbis site being taken a regular ringflash, not an Orbis.
This is absolute rubbish. I can say this with certainty because I took about half of those photos myself. That's my blue sleeved arm holding up my Canon 5D, with a prototype Orbis in my other hand. The resulting images were used for a 6 page fashion editorial in Pulp magazine. My camera settings were F8, 1/100th, 400ISO. It was shot on location (not in studio), during the day, with plenty of ambient light bouncing around.
The Orbis is by no means a substitute for a big, expensive, pack powered ringflash. It's not meant to be.
It's just a really beautiful piece of kit that's easy to carry, quick to set up, and IMHO gives extremely flattering results.
PS: Obviously I know James (the Orbis inventor) personally, but I am just one of several volunteer (i.e. unpaid) prototype testers. (Full disclosure: he has bought me a beer on the odd occasion.)
Wow, what a fascinating run of comments. I'd just like to add that I've ordered mine, and assuming the info on the Orbis website is correct then many of the issues raised above have been dealt with. The gallery shows several images which purport to have been lit using solely the Orbis - hover your cursor over the bottom of the images to see the lighting info. Some are lit by softboxes with the orbis as fill but that's exactly what I'd want to see too - it looks like a great fill light (as David has been saying recently too - about the Ray Flash).
Yes, it needs to be hand held but the light source is larger than the Ray Flash so softer and closer to the look of the more expensive Alienbees etc. Personally I don't think the price is too much - but I run a business and can appreciate the amount of work that has gone into this, both in R&D and marketing.
The hand held issue is a slight concern but I'll see when it arrives. The comment above about using a monopod/lightstand is a good start though.
Anyway, I've ordered mine and I just hope it's as good as it looks.
… listen up Radiopoppers – get your act together and start shipping to the UK too ;-)
I want to know if theres anyway to put it on a light stand?????
@ Dave: I think if you have an lightstand adapter for your on-camera flashes, you are able to put it on an lightstand. The orbis is designed to be put on top of an on camera flash (which is held off camera ;-)).
@ David: Thank you very much for the infos, as allways your site has helped me an great deal. You are the best.
Cheers
@ewen cafe
the Rayflash does not come in a configuration to suit Sony/Minolta gear
This is incorrect. The RAC170-2 fits the Sony HVL-F56AM mounted on the A100, A200, A350, & A700. I have just verified that the RAC175-2 is a perfect fit for my HVL-F58AM mounted on my A900.
Looks like it would be great for a couple of Dave Hill style kickers, you know behind the subject off at 45 degrees. Flare you say? Maybe, but I am constantly amazed how little flare i get when shooting digitally. Also: If someone made a bag that these things fit into and then could double as a sling for the auxiliary battery packs while you use it then we'd be cooking with grease.
There must be a way to attach it to the lens itself via the lens hood (the lens mount can take a hell of a lot more weight than the flash hotshoe!)
There are a couple of things that would tip me toward the Orbis rather than the ray flash
1. It's cheaper!
2. It can be used with a much larger range of strobes (the Rayflash is only designed to fit the top of the range Canon and Nikon flashes).
3. You can mount it in a way that doesn't block the AF assist lamp which could be crucial in certain circumstances.
I see it as a very good alternative to direct flash for places with dark/non-existant ceilings!
I can't believe how many people have stated it's a deal killer for them that the orbis doesn't attach to the camera or lens. What happened to the DIY mentality here? By the time I realised it didn't attach, I had already figured out how I would attach it with bogen parts I already own.
@steve - of course you can attach it to a lightstand as the hotshoe would be poking out from the bottom so just attach the strobe to the stand as you normally would et voila!
can you say early Christmas?
YAY!
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